Star Wars: The Last Jedi

[spoiler]They ruined Luke’s character with him attempting to kill Kylo, Rey’s parents are random drunkards which contradicts her implied origin in TFA, First Order never thought to intercept our heroes simply by calling in reinforcement ships, the Finn/Rose casino subplot was pointless and silly, the convenient nearby planet near the end, Snoke died too early and he was used as a cheap plot device, his guards were useless and had no motivation to fight once their leader was dead, Kylo and Rey never teamed up after the guard fight, Yoda’s ghost wanted to burn the ancient Jedi texts for some reason, we don’t know why since the texts are never explored. Also Yoda thought Rey’s training was complete which confused me since Luke only trained her for like three days or so. The constant jokes. Chewie never thought to send fuel to the Resistance using Leia’s Paypal account while he was stuffing his face with Porgs on Ahch-To. Leia flew like an space eagle, Luke milked that…thing, I really wanted to see that!

But seriously I did enjoy like the ending with Luke’s sacrifice and the new animal species that were introduced. I liked the scene where Luke reunited with R2. Benicio Del Toro’s acting was great. I liked Poe in this one. As stupid as it was, the lightspeed crash was cool. Otherwise I wasn’t terribly interested.
[/spoiler]

4 Likes

Okay, just got back from watching it. I’m just waiting for nine to tie it all together…

[spoiler]I loved this movie. My heart hurts to see so many sad things happen, and my voice aches from yelling at people just to wait until nine

For one, the two characters in the First Order I actually liked (Phasma and Snoke) are um… dead. Phasma was cool for her parts, but do I wish they would have explained the trash compactor, or shown her without her helmet? Yes.

Snoke died by um… I’ll get to Kylo Ren later. But he did die, and I’m sad to say they never explained it. However, I have theories. If Maul can survive falling down a shaft missing half of his body just on the dark side and pure hatred, I don’t see why Snoke can’t. Everyone I watched the movie with seemed mad about Snoke not getting a story, but I just told them to wait. Honestly, I’m just glad he isn’t Windu. If he is Plaigus, and he could survive death by the Emperor’s hand, what’s to stop him from surviving Ren?

I cried. The second movie I’ve cried in, the first being Rogue One. It was not when Snoke died, or when Phasma did, or when Leia and Finn (nearly) did. It was Admiral Ackbar. He has been a favorite of mine since I can remember, and to see him go is like to see Finn go to me. Actually, I was really scared to see what was about to happen to Finn.

The new characters were cool. Rose was awesome, Holdo’s death made me absolutely respect the character so much, and DJ was interesting. If Snoke counts as new, I went from hating him in Force Awakens, to loving him here.

Returning characters were cool too. My highlights: Poe and his sweet piloting skills. It was sad to see his X-Wing go. Luke, being the disappointment and then the hero of the century. Finn, being cool, Rey, though not becoming bad, Admiral Ackbar, for giving it his all, Phasma, for coming back at all, and to top it off: BB-8. Just everything he did made me love the character more. However, the one I was most happy to see returning was obviously Yoda. Let’s go little guy.

My least favorite character hands-down: KYLO REN. He just was all-around weak and whiny and HE WAS UGLY. They even showed him without his ■■■■■, and I wanted to puke. Seriously, though, he acts like he’s strong and then he goes and gets wrecked by a VISION. COME ON, MAN! My favorite scene with him was when Snoke was saying he was “too weak to be a Vader”. I completely agree.

Basically everything I wanted to happen did not happen. (DJ being the real code breaker, Lando returning, Rey betraying, her grandfather being Palpatine, Snoke being Plaigus (I know I spelled that wrong), Ackbar LIVING (same with Phasma and Snoke) But, you know, just because as far as we know Boba Fett is dead, and because of this my three favorite characters all DIED, that’s okay and all. And now, I’ll cry myself to sleep.[/spoiler]

3 Likes

So I absolutely loved the last jedi. It’s tied with Logan for my favorite movie of the year. Everyone in this was fantastic, especially Mark Hamill Adam driver and Carrie Fisher. Of course I had a few issues with it (the prequelesque chase scene and and the occasional joke getting in the way of a serious scene in particular.) but I loved everything else. I loved how they basically said no theories mattered anymore and they were telling their own story which kept me guessing throughout the film which was great. I liked the cameos. All the new characters I at the very least liked. This is Mark Hamill’s best performance as well as Carrie Fisher’s. They really don’t know how to handle phasma though do they? I mean I liked the fight but she went out like a punk. and I really look forward to see how they move forward past this. (This whole experience has really affirmed how little audience scores mean anything though, I mean seriously, this movie’s audience score is half the size of justice league). Also people have been complaining about how can Rey defend herself, but come on if you are a girl growing up alone on an almost lawless planet you would learn how to defend yourself.

6 Likes

I liked the movie. I understand people disliking it, but there have been some rabid fans who have sent death threats to Rian Johnson and IMO are over-reacting far too much.

Albeit I did find Leia floating through space to be kind of stupid. At least it paid off with her good leadership skills in the end of the film.

As to what @Likus said… what was implied about her parentage? There were tons of red herrings that they threw around in TFA. The trailers for TFA said Rey was a nobody; that’s what it’s been from the beginning. It came across that way for me, at least.

3 Likes

[spoiler]Yeah, I agree with some of those. But there are others that were explained, or that they tried to explain.

I felt like Luke’s character didn’t work very well. Some tiny changes to the script where he was less comical would’ve helped a lot, the only time it really felt like Luke was near the end where he realized he was wrong and with his fight against Kylo. First Order reinforcements thing really was plot connivence, so the bad guys don’t instantly win. Casino I’m iffy about. On one hand, I feel that in terms of the story, it was needed. They needed to go there to reach the code breaker, and save the fleet. On the other hand, I feel like they could’ve easily executed that concept a lot better. They tried to explain the planet by saying that they had planned to lightspeed there originally since there was a remote rebel base with what they needed. I also wish that Snoke was expanded on a bit, as imo he was killed off with too little backstory. The guards were more there just for actions, plus being Snoke’s personal guard would make them really loyal to him. Kylo and Rey is something I was hoping to see more of. Yoda burning the texts was sorta explained, since he said that they were really boring and not neccesary to teaching Jedi, and he was basically making Luke’s choice for him. I can’t remember if they said Rey’s training was complete. I do remember them saying that she already knew all the ancient texts had to offer though.

Most of the jokes were too much.

I don’t think the Resistance and the Falcon had any means of communication on board the falcon besides that one beacon Rey had. The last two I feel are really just personal opinions.

Reading back over my post, I doubt this will really sway your opinion. I feel like it might explain why they did stuff, but it doesn’t excuse all the flaws with the execution.

I’m surprised you didn’t bring up the opening sequence. I felt that it dragged on way too long.[/spoiler]

I get why people are mad over that Leia scene. I had no problem with it though. Because it was something I always assumed jedi could do with enough focus. And yeah sending death threats to people is never cool.

1 Like

[spoiler]I also don’t get the complaints of them “ruining” Luke Skywalker’s character. He lashed at out at Vader in ROTJ, and certainly made poor choices constantly. If anything, this version handled it well, with Luke realizing that he was being too hasty and over-reacting. By that time, thought, 'twas too late.

I also like how he understood the Force better. His complaints about the Jedi bringing imbalance to the galaxy were well-placed, but in the end he understood what he had to do. It’s a really deep character arc, and I don’t know why people dislike it, especially since it feels like the way Luke from the OT would most definitely act.

As for Rey’s origins, I thought it worked splendidly. Snoke said that Rey was an awakening in the force, and Luke emphasized the Force will ALWAYS seek to be balanced. This implies that since the Dark Side has reigned, the Force needed to give a balance to it. Rey just so happened to be in the right places for it. Rey being a Skywalker or a Kenobi would have never explained why she got powers for no reason, so this was a much better explanation.

Snoke was… Alright I guess. I never was interested in him anyways. Would it have been nice to explore his background? Yes. I don’t even care anymore though. Kylo is the real star of the show though, and I think Rian Johnson understood this.[/spoiler]

4 Likes

Yoda didn’t burn the texts, Rey most likely grabbed them before she left. You could see them at the end in the Falcon when Fibb was grabbing his jacket

2 Likes

@OmegaTahu [spoiler]I had no problem with the opening sequence. Star Wars is an action movie franchise so it makes sense to start it with an exciting space battle. They had to set up Rose’s sister in there to explain the necklace. I felt it was the right length.

Come to think of it, the force ghosts exist in the ST now so where was Anakin’s ghost? Why didn’t he communicate with Kylo Ren? I guess Kylo’s mind is so clouded by the dark side that he cannot see light side force ghosts.
[/spoiler]

@Chronicler It’s implied that her parents were skilled force sensitives due to her learning the force with no on-screen training which would imply Jedi/Sith parentage. By the looks of it, there are many force-sensitive children out there without Jedi/Sith parents now due to the broom kid we saw, so Rey’s parentage does make sense, but it doesn’t necessarily make for an interesting story. I’d rather follow the story of two Jedi that fell in love vs some random deadbeat parents.

1 Like

I can see the logic behind it, I just feel the choice made for the film was better imo.

I’ll admit that Luke thinking about killing Ben is odd, given his devotion to saving Vader, but he stated that it was a completely emotional impulse that lasted for a total of maybe one second…that’s not something that completely changes a character, because everyone has those out-of-character thoughts from time to time.

Rey’s parentage contradicts nothing that was stated in TFA. Assuming that a Force-Sensitive child must have Force-Sensitive parents devalues the Force just as much as the hated midichlorians do, as it implies that the Force is something you get with genes, not because the Force chooses you to wield it. Does it make sense for powerful Force-wielders to have children that are strong with the Force? Yes, but that doesn’t make the Force totally determined by blood. Rey being the parents of no one is better for this story than any connection she could have had, because it rejects the implausible notion that the all-powerful Force would choose to keep its chosen wielders within one family.

The First Order didn’t need to waste reinforcements on the Resistance, as they could track them wherever they went, and they were running out of fuel. They were also painfully outmatched, which means that wasting resources to destroy them was unnecessary.

Crait’s not a “convenient planet”–it’s almost-outright stated by Leia that she and Holdo knew it was there and were purposefully heading towards it.

Snoke’s death is probably the single greatest thing this movie did, IMO. Our attachment to him as fans is solely based upon how much we have played him up to be someone of importance. He’s not important, and neither is his identity. He dies because of the movie’s underlying theme about how failure is a teacher. Snoke doesn’t learn from failure, he simply continues to manipulate and scheme, never contemplating that his constant meddling could turn out unexpectedly. A lot of people are saying that he was a complete idiot for claiming to be invincible and then dying like that, and they’re right. Snoke is an idiot. That’s why he’s dead.

The guards do have a motive to fight. Capturing Snoke’s murderers for General Hux.

Why is Kylo and Rey not teaming up after the fight a bad thing? Is there a law out there that says that a character who turns from evil to “good” must have good intentions behind it? Kylo killed Snoke to take charge of the First Order. Rey’s obviously not going to like that, so it’s entirely illogical for them to continue working together after the fight.

Yoda’s “reason” for burning the tree is directly stated–it’s time for the old ways of the Jedi to take a backseat. It doesn’t matter what’s in the texts, because their teachings are not relevant to Rey’s situation. They may be relevant in the future (hence why she took them), but Yoda’s point is that the ways of the past don’t always work in the present. Also, he never said her training was complete. He said that she knew all that she needed to know at the moment. Even Luke still needed training in this film…it’s never truly complete.

What’s wrong with the humor? Sure, not all of it landed, but you can’t just say “jokes were bad” without giving a logical reason for it.

I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make about Chewie and Leia’s Paypal, or if it’s sarcastic. After all, Chewie wasn’t aware of what was going on with the Resistance, as by my recollection he was never informed of it until Rey wanted to go find Kylo.

Leia’s Mary Poppins moment was cheesy looking, I’ll admit, but the concept is fine, and rather cool. It could have been better visually, but it’s not a make-or-break moment.

Again, I can’t see why Luke milking the creature on Ahch-To was a bad decision for any logical reason. Was it necessary? No, but it was funny, and not everything in a movie has to be necessary to its plot, because then we’d have movies that were an hour long, completely stiff and heartless, and devoid of any kind of humor or whimsicality.

3 Likes

[spoiler]Thank you, @Toa_Heatwave. I was about to take it upon myself to explain things, but you beat me to it. So, I’ll just add some points.

@Likus They did not ruIn Luke’s character. He never really was the best Jedi, and he even said it was an emotional impulse, like what @Toa_Heatwave said, and you can not tell me that he did not have an impulse to kill Vader. It was even wanted by Yoda and Kenobi.

We still don’t even know if her parents are “random”. They might not even be drunkards. I can tell you that what is most likely going to be the new prevailing theory is that DJ is her father. At least I think. And even then, what if Rey’s parents are important, and after the Galactic Civil War, they just drink to forget it all. I can see Antilles traveling that path perhaps.

We don’t know why no First Order ships were called in. I bet the most likely circumstance is that they were preoccupied, perhaps fighting the Rebels in the Outer Rim that were unable to rescue those on Crait.

I did not think the Casino was silly. If the lesson of the movie was to learn from failure, this was the biggest example of that. Besides, if it was not included, we would never have met the kid at the end.

Snoke did not die too easily. Perhaps for as powerful a character as he was, but he is a seducer and a deceiver. In the end, he was decieved. And, if he’s Plaigus, I wouldn’t be surprised if he died twice! And I remember walking out of the theater after TFA thinking Phasma was a waste and shouldn’t have died with as little of a part she had in that movie.

For the guards, after Padmé died, what reason did Vader have for staying on the Dark Side? What reason did the Empire have for fighting after the Emperor died? How about the Seperatists after Dooku passed away? Because of the vision. They were still loyal to the First Order, and Kylo Ren just betrayed them. And, they may have been avenging their leader.

The reason why Kylo and Rey didn’t team up is because they wanted two things. Kylo wanted power, Rey wanted balance.

Yoda said the texts were useless anyways. The texts basically just said all the rules the Jedi follow. At least, that’s how I understand it.

I don’t remember Yoda ever saying Rey’s training is complete. Besides, she was much more open to learning than Luke was, and even than Luke was to teaching.

I liked the jokes, so that’s just an opinion.

If you’re serious about Chewbacca, think about this: they have no way of communicating with Resistance, and even then, they don’t have money. If they were to steal some, well you’d just have yourself another Casino scene if you disliked that so much.

Leia, I admit it was weird, but not impractical. I’m kind of nervous to see how they handle her in nine, Carrie Fischer being… dead and all…

The cow was very vital to the plot. She’s both Rey and Snoke’s mother. You can tell because if you watch the seen where she goes through the hole in the island, Rey’s shadow is the creature. And when Snoke get cut in half, you can see his belly bulging in the same place as the cow.

Who’d Benecio Del Toro act as? Was that DJ?

Poe was almost as much of a boss as his astromech was.

The lightspeed crash was my favorite death. Not because I was happy Holdo died, but because she sacrificed herself by taking out so much First Order toys… I wish Admiral Ackbar did that.

So, to everyone else, what were your favorite parts? Was it sad to see Ackbar go? (I mainly ask this because @Kalmah_Ren told me no one cared about him. Now, for all of you who are dissapointed about Snoke and Rey’s parents, here’s something I noticed that was off. They played the Emperor’s theme when Snoke first started using th Force on Rey. Why? Perhaps we’ll find out. This can mean hope for Rey’s parents being cool, or Snoke getting a backstory. What do you guys think?[/spoiler]

3 Likes

[spoiler]Yeah, imo it could’ve gotten the same message across in a shorter time. There’s nothing really wrong with it tho.

@BioKnight Oh yeah, you did see them in the falcon. I don’t know if Yoda and Luke would’ve known that. I wonder if Force Ghosts know everything.[/spoiler]

I actually liked how long it went. You get to the climax, and BOOM you still got Battle of Crait to look forward too. I gotta admit though, the scene with the Resistance getting ready in the canyons with the walkers and the flat white background and the speeders and the buildings that troopers looked out of felt a lot like Empire. I’m actually surprised it was at the end.

I saw this movie

Without spoiling, it is as good as bad fanfiction

5 Likes

I just saw the movie. I’m beyond confused.

4 Likes

I do really enjoy seeing the spectrum of opinions on this movie. From how this is looking this is probably the most divisive movie of the year.

Yoda knew. He said “Wisdom they held, but that library contained nothing that the girl Rey does not already possess.” He didn’t mean she possessed the knowledge found in the books, he literally meant she had already taken them

3 Likes

This was definately in my top few movies of the year. It was amazingly written, visually stunning, and just overall epic! My one gripe is that particular subplot that felt odd. I loved Luke’s ark. He’s always been my favorite Star Wars character, so it was like a punch to the childhood when he died. That said, it was done great. My jaw dropped when Ben killed Snoke and he and Rey fought the guards. That was possibly my favorite Star Wars action scene. The best part of that was that I thought Ben had been redeemed… and then I was wrong, which sucked. Also, Yoda’s awesome. In regards to Phasma, I have a feeling she’ll be back somehow. She strikes me as a “Why won’t you just stay dead” character. I can’t wait till IX!

2 Likes

I also loved the way they ended luke’s Story. The way he was looking out into the twin sunset was the perfect way to bookend his adventure by mirroring a new hope.

2 Likes